Over at TheFirearmBlog, there’s a post reviewing the S&W 642 and asking if it’s the ideal first gun (and the article concludes that it is).
As someone who owns and carries a S&W442 (essentially the same thing as a 642) as a backup gun, as someone that’s trained with Claude Werner, and as a firearms instructor, I disagree with much that was written in that article. I would have commented, but there’s just too much to pick apart.
On a very hot day here in the Midwest nothing is handier to grab and run a few errands.
Why should the weather dictate your choice in defensive armament? I do understand why people think this way, but I cannot agree with it. You don’t get to choose when and how an attack will come… and weather will have very little to do with it. It’s not like the bad guys are going to say “geez… it’s hot out, let’s only put 3 guys in our flash mob… but just wait until wintertime! we’ll have 50 of us then!”
The only downside to some shooters is that it only holds five rounds.
So, there are some shooters that find only 5 rounds a plus? I guess if they’re used to single-shot guns, then 5 rounds is an upgrade. But bad guys travel in packs, even more so these days. Only 5 rounds is rather unsuitable. It’s better than zero, but it’s still too few. The author continues:
This really isn’t a drawback when you consider what this revolvers intended use is. A “J” frame 642 isn’t normally a primary carry gun rather a backup too a duty gun or one you drop into a pocket for a quick run to the grocery store.
Ah, so few rounds is OK because it’s a backup gun. I don’t know… if I could have 2 XD-9’s on me, that second gun with 15 rounds in it would sure make for a handier backup. Furthermore, having 2 of the same means sharing ammo and components are easier instead of having to carry reloads for the primary gun AND reloads for the secondary gun, which can’t be shared. So still, a snub as a backup sucks. But yes, I do carry that way, because I accept the limitations and benefits that a snub brings (there are things revolvers can do that semi-autos cannot, like contact shots).
But what gets me more is the author says a snub is not intended to be a primary gun, but then says it’s perfect for slipping into the pocket to run to the grocery store. Um… if you do that, you’ve just made it your primary. I thought it’s not a gun that’s good for being a primary, so why are you making it into one? Your primary carry gun isn’t the gun you WANT to carry most of the time, it’s the gun that you are carrying on you RIGHT NOW and that you go to first when the fur flies. If you have only one gun on you, that’s the gun you’re going to go to first… that is your primary gun. Using the author’s logic, a snub isn’t intended to be a primary gun, is only good as a backup gun, and thus it should be the SECOND gun that you carry on you. Thus, when you’re making the quick run to the grocery store, you should slip on your 1911 first, then throw the snub in your pocket.
And why “for a quick run to the grocery store”. Do you get to choose when your attack will come? Do you get to decide upon the circumstances and how many attackers you will have? Are the chances of an attack and/or the potential serverity of an attack on a quick run to the grocery store somehow different from attacks in other contexts? And the data you have to back this up is…? Looking at the almost 60 incidents Tom Givens students have been involved in in the past 15 years, and I dare say it’s those quick runs to the grocery store that actually have the greatest potential (attacks happen in parking lots, convenience stores, gas stations, parking garages, going to/from your car, to/from the building). Why aren’t you setting yourself up for success?
Furthermore, one could also say, “throwing a gun in your pocket” implies that you’re walking around without any gun on. Why not? Again, do you get to choose when you’ll need it?
Speaking of practice these revolvers require the owner to practice a good deal to be able to handle it quickly and shoot accurately. Most encounters are seven yards and closer but you can still miss. Believe me I’ve read reports where it’s happened and more times than one would think. When you mix adrenalin and the short sight radius of these small frame guns it’s easy to miss. Any person who carries a gun should practice, practice and more practice to be proficient in handling and shooting. It’s a serious responsibility any CCW owner should take to heart.
This is one paragraph in the article I can agree with. These are tough guns to shoot well. Yes, most people CAN shoot them, in terms of performing the manipulations and basic action of “point and click”. But to shoot them accurately and well enough, especially in a pressure situation, is actually quite difficult. You do need training and you do need practice. If you can get snub-specific training, that’s all the better.
when I’m asked “ which gun should I buy” my usual response is a “J” frame S&W. Once you master this revolver then move to a semi-auto if you like but learn the basics first.
So why is a revolver “the basics”? And why is it necessary to master that first? I guess then we’re teaching things wrong by showing people a wide range of guns, both semi-autos and revolvers, and then directing people to semi-autos. We find that it’s more important to help people find a gun that fits them and they can shoot and enjoy, which will lead to them wanting to continue to shoot, seek training, go to the range and practice. Revolvers have long, heavy trigger pulls and are set in a way that a lot of people just can’t shoot. I have had women in beginner classes that just can’t pull that trigger or can only do so with a lot of exertion, and we’re even talking on a revolver with a trigger job! I bring my 442 to beginner classes to let beginners try it out, because we know it’s such common advice for first-time buyers to be told to get a J-frame. We let them shoot one with regular .38 Special practice rounds (i.e. not +P), and many find the shooting to be unpleasant for a number of reasons: because they can’t get their full firing hand on the gun, because they can’t get their support hand on the gun, because that exposed backstrap smacks the dickens out of your palm, because the sights suck and it’s hard to get good aimed fire, and so on. Oh sure, get some big grips to soak up that recoil, but that defeats the purpose of the tiny gun for “pocket carry”. I’ve only had a couple of beginners enjoy shooting the snub, and the common thing they had were men with big, strong, meaty hands (or maybe they were being macho and didn’t want to admit it hurt, I don’t know… but let’s have them try shooting 50 or 100 rounds through it and see how their hands feel… then try 100 rounds through a good semi-auto and compare).
Learning the basics are important, but basics are things like sight picture and trigger control… both of which are rather difficult with a snub revolver.
As a choice for a first gun or for a seasoned shooter using the 642 as a backup you can’t beat them. Actual prices are good and within the budget of most people looking for an excellent gun at a reasonable price. They are simple to learn and operate. All “j” frames regardless of your choice of model are as near 100% reliable as any gun can be. The 38 +P is an effective round with a reasonable amount of recoil for fast followup shots. I highly recommend them no matter what your experience level.
“As a choice for a first gun”…. but, if by the author’s own admission this isn’t to be a primary gun, then by no means should this be a first gun — because if it’s a first gun, then it’s the only gun, and then by default it’s the primary gun.
I will agree with the middle of the paragraph: prices are good, they are simple to learn and operate (but difficult to master), they are very reliable, .38 Special +P is effective (but the felt recoil will vary and can be bothersome in this gun).
I do highly recommend a snub revolver — but only for experienced shooters.
If it’s someone’s first gun, they will find it difficult to shoot and to find success with. It’s important to set beginners up for success so they’ll continue to make progress, and a gun that’s hard to shoot isn’t going to help them.
If it’s intended as a backup gun and not a primary gun, then keep it to that role. No matter the weather, no matter the circumstances, you don’t get to choose when or how bad things will happen. The rise of “flash mobs” these days, and do you want to face down a group of 10+ hooligans with your 5-shot snub? As the saying goes, a gun isn’t supposed to be comfortable, it’s supposed to be comforting.
I love my snub, but it’s important to know its role, it’s limitations, and it’s place. There are many types of guns on the market, many of which make far better choices for a first gun.
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